To find this position, slightly loosen the four cap screws that support the quadrant. TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. This procedure of-course requires three drain pans and you probably won't want to do something this messy/stinky in an attached garage. Water isn't flowing thru a damaged shifter boot into the sump. Other than that I just dress the gravel drive a few times. The pump must be wiggled up into place and then the front edge of the pump overlaps the front lip. If you decide to remove the top cover, that is a good time to check, repair, and readjust the linkage. Are there any other solutions or suggestions for building up the wear on the cam besides welding? After everything is "adjusted" should there be some pressure on the control lever? Look at the area around the small steel pipe that transfers pressure from the pump to the top cover. "dateModified": "2015-06-09", The shifter is a ball and socket that seals well. ditto that. 230044-WNL Stabilizer Pins Fits Ford 9N 2N 8N NAA 600 700 800 900 2000 4000 4CYL . This is an excellent time to rebuild the lift cylinder also. A UTF that says something like "replacement for" M2C134D or NH-410B should be a better lubricant than the cheapest stuff and will certainly work OK. Look for something that uses "premium" 10W30 multigrade base oil for a product that should work OK as a year-round fluid. If its really stuck tight, youll have to pull the pump and rebuild it. Should the cam be smooth across its width? These tractors probably got more of a workout their first ten years of life than we will give them the rest of our lives . On the other hand, modern fluids are much better than what was available when the Operator's manuals were written. Of course we would recommend welding / brazing it or taking some where while it is apart . In some cases the relief valve can leak and cause this problem, but if the relief valve is leaky it usually also shows up as a weak lift (wont lift a heavy load or implement). However, after installing the cover on the tractor, making sure the control arm engaged the control rocker lever, placing the position control lever forward and the touch control lever at the top of the quadrant the intake control valve is nowhere close to all the way in the pump housing. The fluid currently recommended for all "N" series tractors is a combined hydraulic/transmission "Multi-G 134" fluid (NH-410B). Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. It is bent forward which I thought would help if anything, wrong? If you plan to flush it anyway, drain the plugs in any order you want. This could be severe leakage at the cylinder, a bad relief valve, or a badly worn pump. }, "height": 57 Drain the sump. I cant seem to find if this is one solid tube? Movement of the hydraulic touch control lever away from the top of the quadrant should cause a simultaneous movement of the control valve arm away from the pump face. Your email address will not be published. Internal Adjustments. We keep the brush down in the woods. Ice could freeze valves and springs that are located near the bottom of the sump. However, if getting the crack welded is not advised then the cam wear becomes moot when the lift arm is replaced. Here are some suggestions to get you started fixing your tractor. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Right. "@type": "ImageObject", A really hard freeze could actually crack something. It is bent to the front which I would think would help me. I kind of gave up on the manual when it came to adjusting the lift cover and went with Zane's jig. I.E., I can grab it and move it freely front to back. It just ain't possible to adjust the lift linkage on the 8N Ford unless you have a jig to use so that the end of the control rod ends up in the right position. Think about how much water one iced tea glass can leave on a table. How does water get inside the sump? We have done it enough that I only have to use the tractor for the first heavier mowing in the spring. Learn how your comment data is processed. 8n position control adjustment discussion in the Ford 9N.draft links changes the deflection of the load control shaft PGJ Installation and Adjustment of Arch, Radius, Precipitation Rate and Nozzle with Video Some of the most frequently asked ones are listed at the bottom of this page An estimator to track the states of the UAV using the images. Its generally not an immediate pressing problem. I just replied to another response to my post, with a pic and a question. Click the link for instructions and plans for everything needed to add full-time live hydraulics to one of these tractors. ", Water in the hydraulic fluid is very bad. "width": 200, In this case the NAA seal will work better, but only for a short time. Or do I need to move it to "position Control" to transport my plow? I would cut a big V into the crack and weld it with a 7018 rod. This one is a separate page Live Hydraulics. If those didn't do the trick I would then go back to removing the yoke, etc. The new Position Control setting bypassed the draft control and allowed the implement to remain at a consistent position relative to the position of the Touch Control lever.A continued drawback to this series of tractor, was the safety need for an overrunning clutch at the end of the PTO shaft.. Choke Control Rod Assembly.Ford - Fits: 2N, 9N; Replaces: 9N9700 * Fits (1939-47)* NOTE: this is 1 . "dateModified": "2001-10-31", Get to the tough questions and you go all shy on me? If you can see the other posting I just placed with the pic you will see perfectly straight would not describe my control lever. It can be done, but I think that qualifies as abuse. (b) Operation of Valve. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Get a replacement or straighten the one you have. Make sure the rod is connected and that it is moving the control valve spools in and out as you move the lift control lever up and down. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see I was wondering if someone had bent it intentionally as a fix . Pic attached. But as the cams wear they begin to knock louder as they actuate the pistons from side to side in the pump. "name": "Jasmith503" It is critical. "interactionStatistic": { It just ain't possible to adjust the lift linkage on the 8N Ford unless you have a jig to use so that the end of the control rod ends up in the right position. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V. window.dataLayer = window.dataLayer || []; function gtag(){dataLayer.push(arguments);} gtag('js', new Date()); gtag('config', 'G-04SJ2KTSCK',{ cookie_flags: 'max-age=7200;secure;samesite=none' }); Welcome! My hydraulic pump makes knocking noises under load.. "publisher": { It runs out quicker and more "stuff" is suspended in it. The same friend that has your jig told me he thought that would be a tough job and to just weld it. If the oil looks milky, its got water in it. Are you having trouble with your Ford 8N hydraulics? Make a The PTO shaft should spin when you release the clutch. JavaScript is disabled. The only way arms go up is to hold draft control lever down. Our property is covered with Douglas Firs. Straightening and repairing the lift arms and other hardware is mostly just time and energy. Maybe not true. This is also usually sold as 80 or 90 weight. Unless you live in a very dry climate, humid air will get in the sump. If it seems like your hydraulics just arent doing anything, be sure to check that the PTO lever is engaged and then try. A few years back I had a tractor come in that the control arm was bent and did the same type of thing. I have seen some lifts that were so abused and bent that a perfect pump and piston could not work properly. No warm-up needed on cold winter mornings to get the lift to work. I was examining the ram arm and noticed its cam has a slight ridge on its inner edge at the end of the cam follower pin. If it won't go easy, stop and figure out why. You can determine if the leakage is coming from the lift cylinder by removing the right side cover (the one with the dipstick) and starting the tractor. Thanks. It helps to have something like a block of wood under an elbow or a floor jack to help hold the pump when it does not go in perfectly on the first try. 1 - Has it rained or been humid recently? If the cam follower pin is worn replace it. It may not display this or other websites correctly. What do you think? The determining factor in which way to go is the condition of the cylinder bore. I just replied to another response to my post, with a pic and a question. Of course, once you diagnose the problem you still need to fix it! Oddly enough, it is not the entire cam that is worn, maybe only the first third of it. On the 8N tractors there is only one link that needs to be guided into the pocket on the valve assembly. To raise the plow pull touch control all the way up to raise the plow. Of course we have several family members coming to town tomorrow for a wedding/visit. It consists of a pto driven piston type pump with internal control valves and a lift cylinder connected to the rear lift arms. The worst spot for that is the drain plug where the pump is. Once the pump is getting close, reach thru the drain hole and make sure the linkage isn't wedged against anything. http://www.bramblett.com/zane/ ZANE Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Zane, Thanks for the info. Dean Thanks, I guess my lift issues may have been a blessing as they led to finding the crack. $32.95 . ", For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. He ships the jig with documentation that has helpful hints about things to check that the manual doesn't talk about that'd keep one from getting the proper adjustment. It usually takes 4-1/2 to 4-3/4 gallons not 5 as stated in the owner's manual. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V. window.dataLayer = window.dataLayer || []; function gtag(){dataLayer.push(arguments);} gtag('js', new Date()); gtag('config', 'G-04SJ2KTSCK',{ cookie_flags: 'max-age=7200;secure;samesite=none' }); Welcome! Regardless of the position of my quadrant support plate, I cannot get the valve completely open as directed in step 7a. Attach a heavy implement (anything weighing at least 150 pounds should be enough). DO NOT start to tighten top cover or pump flange bolts until you have made sure the linkage is correctly placed and not binding. I couldn't even get the lift arm off of the end of the splined shaft. You've done it, I haven't. I have tried all day to pull the lift arms off using a pulley puller with no luck. }, If that link is bent, it needs to be straightened in a vise or press. I.E., I can grab it and move it freely front to back. 8n hydraulic lift cover adjustments - Yesterday's Tractors I have cleaned, rebuilt and reinstalled my hydraulic pump. Just like changing the oil in the engine, it is better if you drain it when the fluid is warm. Contact Us I also removed the lift cover and checked and adjusted the constant draft and position cont Welcome! Pic attached. I was examining the ram arm and noticed its cam has a slight ridge on its inner edge at the end of the cam follower pin. (gritting of the teeth) How's this procedure Zane? Now Zane, that sounds like a challenge that I'm up to. "interactionType": "https://schema.org/CommentAction", } "interactionType": "https://schema.org/CommentAction", It just ain't possible to adjust the lift linkage on the 8N Ford unless you have a jig to use so that the end of the control rod ends up in the right position. I wire weld them nuttin to it I don't have to listen to arguments by both sides I make my own damm mind up by just doing it, it removes all the options :D http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/viewtopic.php?t=869783&highlight=weld Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Thanks for the note that the washer can overdue it, that's what I was wanting to know. This post was edited by jasmith503 at 16:47:01 06/09/15. I've done this with the seat removed, laying on the tractor, with an arm in each hole. Look for leaks coming from above. Any comments would be welcome. Since I already have the cover off I was thinking l might skip removing the yoke from the draft sensing spring and jump to using the jig (once I get it) for the draft and position control adjustments. If my brother-in-law has any luck with that I'll use your suggestion on cutting the arm ram off. This is listed as a 5/16 x 7/8 dowel pin but it is actually .309 diameter not 5/16 (.3125). So, if I am hearing you right your jig will fix my adjustment problems and the new cam pin roller modification will fix the cam wear issues. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Thanks for the note that the washer can overdue it, that's what I was wanting to know. My brother-in-law, who is a boat mechanic, is coming by tomorrow. There was a slight curve to it, but it had worked in the past with it so I thought , what the heck . So, is it wear or suppose to have concave groove to rest on the dowell? My brother-in-law, who is a boat mechanic, is coming by tomorrow. My guess is that someone used a pin that was too short & too hard. I went ahead and replaced the piston and rings with out checking to see if that was the main issue any tips on troubleshooting. Once I get the lift arm ram welded I will proceed with the jig. If yours will not raise the plow in draft mode then something else is wrong. Our property is covered with Douglas Firs. If the cylinder bore is in good shape or has only very faint scratches or grooves use the NAA piston and seal. If someone has substituted bolts where there should be pins, replace them with the correct hardware. Almost like the pin wore down the cam rather than the pin being worn. I'll hold off on that and try without first. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Thanks. Any suggestions? If the hydraulics either go all the way up or all the way down (with no control in the middle), the problem is likely with your pivot pins. Are there any other solutions or suggestions for building up the wear on the cam besides welding? Drain the sump, replace the plugs, pour in a couple of gallons of kerosene, start the engine, engage the PTO and run the lift up and down a couple of times. Thanks guys - this is exactly how it works. Figured that out after I sent the last message. I'll send an e-mail to your site. Luckily the tractor gets little work. Simple. Some people recommend flushing the system with kerosene or diesel fuel. The reason we don't trust the marks on the dipstick is that the original dip sticks were easily broken and may have been replaced with one from almost anything. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see If I could not add metal to build up the worn part of the cam I would install a longer pin and live with it . Dont use a high pressure or youll blast the piston out of there like a rocket. In cold climates the water can freeze and break the chambers in the pump. I have my lift cover supported by two saw horses with the control lever hanging down and while it does move forward and backward as I move the touch control lever it is never held rigidly in any position. Maybe not true. I did take a look at it before I put it back together. At the time I had an extra top cover and just installed that on his machine and all was well. Welding is on the long list of things I know nothing about. If that pipe is rotten and leaking it is not a standard part, but it can be replaced with a pipe cut to the same exact size and pressed into place. The control lever and quadrant moves the valve spools on the pump to control the lift. First of all, this the 3rd 8N I've owned since '96. Small leaks tend to get bigger, but you should be able to judge if your leaks are bad enough to have to remove the top cover and fix them. Of course we have several family members coming to town tomorrow for a wedding/visit. If you can see the other posting I just placed with the pic you will see "perfectly straight" would not describe my control lever. This is usually a sign of a defective or sticking valve in the pump. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Right. "@id": "https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/" Extending or neglecting to do fluid changes only guarantees that there will be problems. My lift drifts down when the pto stops.. How did you adjust the draft and position control mechanism? When it stops, tighten the plug. Epoxy? }, "height": 57 LeRoy, my 1951 8n had not been started for 4 years. Can't remember if bent toward the front, back, or sideways. It is impossible to adjust the 8N lift with the instructions in most manuals. Just give them a ring to get started. Do you see that as well or just my original post and your responses? John Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Thanks. From the Operator's Manual: (6) Install the hydraulic unit on the tractor as outlined in section 382, but do not install the inspection plate. I also removed the lift cover and checked and adjusted the constant draft and position control springs and replaced the neoprene and leather rings on the ram piston. "@type": "ImageObject", Tractor Identification & History, About F/FCA How's this procedure Zane? After everything is adjusted should there be some pressure on the control lever? BTW, did you see my bent control arm pic? (800) 853-2651Shop Now TRACTOR PARTS Allis Chalmers Case & David Brown Really not sure what is the best way to go on that. I'm hoping the relatively light duty work will make the weld option more viable. Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see Linkage bent or adjustments not done correctly. Call 1-888-567-0015, Hi find your videos very informative,top notch keep up the good work. (7) Place the position control lever in the forward position. Then, wet some rags & stuff them in the cover to catch the shavings when you grind it back down. "@context":"https://schema.org", "name": "Yesterday's Tractor Co.", The cam follower pin looks perfectly cylindrical. Movement of the control valve arm should begin at the start of movement of the hydraulic touch control lever. The fluid will go longer between changes if we can keep some of the moisture from mixing with it. Where are they and what do they look like? I do see it is bent as well. Yes. Get the adjusting jig from Zane. Another question if I may. Start the tractor, press the clutch, make sure the PTO is engaged. "@type": "InteractionCounter", If you will get one of my 8N lift adjusting jig fixtures you can fix that lift. "width": 200, Oil pressure is supplied to the inlet port of the lift, with the control valve located on or inside the 3 point hitch lift housing. What do you think? You obviously know a lot more about welding than I do. NO, I do not want help improving my ranking on search engines. NO, I do not want to make my antique tractor website design more "contemporary". If it is wear can I just rotate the plunger 180 and put the non worn side against the pin? 2 - Did it freeze last night? If you only have time to do one, do that one. There are two piston assemblies that should move at the same time, and in opposite directions. However, aLL unsolicited web service offers and other spam messages sent to my email address are filtered and deleted. Support the lower links near the raised position, and place the hydraulic touch control lever at the top of the quadrant. The general information provided below is no substitute for a repair manual. 2009-10-02 166108. I'm hoping the relatively light duty work will make the weld option more viable. John Thanks for the suggestion. Is the something else I should change to get the valve to completely open? The valve should be completely open when the hydraulic touch control lever is at the top of the quadrant. "userInteractionCount": 34 Took the yoke off the draft sensing spring. The V8-8N has a Howard step-down that provides a second range of gears approximately 1/3 the normal gear ratios. Same trouble as you were having. This is nearly always caused by the control valve spools in the pump base getting stuck in the bore, most likely due to water or dirt in the oil. This is easy to check just remove the side door and watch the oil move. Just give them a ring to get started. Thanks, while I was hunting around I did see the postings yesterday re Zane's jig, etc. Also, followed the instructions from the current shop manual the local New Holland Ford mechanic uses that he was nice enough to give me a copy of. It's like a 10-30 multigrade motor oil thickness. Crack a drain plug and turn it out about half a turn. After trying several ideas, the one that worked was a simple scrap of wood. It can (and probably should) be lightly honed to a cleanup. A premium full-synthetic that says it "MEETS" NH-410B (M2C-134D) is going to be the most expensive option, but it is also going to be the best all-season fluid and lubricant. Not sure if you saw the pic of the crack in my lift arm ram. "mainEntityOfPage": { Many of our tractors are only weekend warriors, so maybe the fluid only needs to be changed once or twice a year. Be sure to have a good welder do it. Start the tractor, press the clutch, make sure the PTO is engaged. My cam is not worn anywhere close to the pic that Bruce posted. I did a lot of work on the first one, so I'm familiar with how they work, but I've never encountered this problem. After yesterday I don't have a clue how I could get the ram arm out. While reinstalling saw this significant crack in the lift ram arm. "mainEntityOfPage": { Ice could block passages that allow oil to get into the pump. The 9N-2N lift is much simpler with only one external adjustment. "logo": { It seems the only thing I can do is to bend the control arm forward so it will close the valve. Now it is only used about 10 Hours a year. Get a replacement or straighten the one you have. The most common problems with the 8N linkage are wear and bent linkage. The PTO shaft should spin when you release the clutch. Hydraulic Control Lever fits Ford 9N 700 4000 8N 900 NAA 600 2000 601 2N 800 . My Pa's 8N had those for both the lower stop and the upper stop. All N-Series Tractors - Ford-Ferguson 9N, 2N, and Ford 8N. Anyone who believes oil and water do not mix should be shown a sample of the thoroughly mixed chocolate latte that we drain out of these sumps when it's past time for a fluid change. (800) 853-2651Shop Now TRACTOR PARTS Allis Chalmers Case & David Brown Farmall & International Ferguson Ford & New Holland John Deere Oddly enough, it is not the entire cam that is worn, maybe only the first third of it. (b) Operation of Valve. Any improvement will help. Please use the navigational links to explore our website. Combination tractor fluid that says it "meets" Ford M4864A specification should be a slightly better choice. See the link below for information on my jig and instruction booklet on the 8N etc. Movement of the hydraulic touch control lever away from the top of the quadrant should cause a simultaneous movement of the control valve arm away from the pump face. I don't have a welder. ", I have a leak in my oil tube (9n567). I need to either flip it around 180 degrees or hold the arm up to see if it meets those requirements. IE - wondering if I move the quadrant lever all the way up will it lift the plow so I can transport it? and if it looks like the pic, it will need to be repaired. Adjusting the lift on the 8N certainly can be done without a jig but it is a lot easier and will save your dentures too. (7) Place the position control lever in the forward position. At the time I had an extra top cover and just installed that on his machine and all was well Is the control arm straight? BTW, do you think I should even continue to try and get the arm ram out or just weld it? Change it. "publisher": { (2) Put the position control lever in the forward or draft position. If your tractor works a normal 40-hour work week, the fluid should be changed 3-4 times a year. Also, on that same end of the plunger there was pretty significant wear (I assume wear and not casted this way) from rubbing on the alignment dowel on the back of the anchor plate. So, you guilted me into starting with step one. I can add very little to that procedure. Thus, I removed the hydraulic control unit to adjust it. "url": "https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/graphics/smllogo.png", As with other things, I like to tackle any sort of lift problem by first checking the possible causes that are No-Cost or Low-Cost items. "text": "I have cleaned, rebuilt and reinstalled my hydraulic pump. Arms will not go down. Weigh those facts, and it probably works out that even a lightly-used tractor should have the fluid changed at least once a year. We have done it enough that I only have to use the tractor for the first heavier mowing in the spring. My guess is that someone used a pin that was too short & too hard. Reassemble the linkage and adjust as per the shop manual instructions. Flattened it no problem. May have nothing to do with my issues but seems dumb to leave it like that. I'm new to this forum stuff. Never force anything! Remove the right inspection plate that has the hydraulic dip-stick. I think that the cam wear is part of the problem with my lift as well. Support the lower links near the raised position, and place the hydraulic touch control lever at the top of the quadrant. Never plow, etc. I'll hold off on that and try without first. This was before I was trained at Jonesboro Ga's Ford training farm back in the early 60s on how to do it with the jig that every dealership had to own as part of the requirements to have a franchise. I'll let you know how I do. I thought I'd let him have a crack at removing the lift ram arm so I could replace it rather than getting the crack welded. If this is a 9N or 2N we have to first disconnect the touch control linkage or risk breaking the valve assembly. and if it looks like the pic, it will need to be repaired. I can remove the cover and post a pic if it will help. (Long) in the Tractors forum followed by comments. I have a friend that has your jig (or, I should say purchased one). https://www.steinertractor.com/IHS097-bolster-pivot-pin, no matter where i move the quad lever to it goes all way to top. To raise the plow pull touch control all the way up to raise the plow. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. Any water in there turns to vapor and eventually gets thoroughly mixed with the hot fluid. Pull the dipstick and see where the level is. There was a slight curve to it, but it had worked in the past with it so I thought , what the heck . My lift is very jerky and erratic when raising.. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. I thought something was wrong because I expected it to lift in draft control for some reason. Luckily the tractor gets little work. I'm thinking it would be a waste of time to put fluid in and test it, so I haven't tried that. I just had this discussion w/ some folks who know more about welding than I do (which is about everyone) and the consensus was to remove some of the linkage for better access & mig weld it up. }, If the cylinder is leaking, you will see it. Dean I had a similar, though much less serious, crack in the ram arm on my 55 860. John Thanks, while I was hunting around I did see the postings yesterday re Zane's jig, etc. $97.57 $101.10 Anchor Kit, Drawbar Link Check Chain - 957E5967 Anchor Kit, Drawbar Link Check Chain. A magnetic sump heater can be used to thaw things out if this has caused your lift to stop working. There's a good reason to talk about the weather, it affects everything. Simple to make from the hardware store. Thanks to John Smith of Old Ford Tractor for allowing us to use this information. The scrap was cut to 0.375" x 0.75" x 3.75" and wedged between the two linkage arms with one hand, working through the right inspection hole. It goes in the lower front pivot bolster and looks like this.
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